verushka70

Yeah, the fact that there's real history supporting the fannish side of things is just delightful, really. I do think that day-to-day life has always had an LGTB+ aspect to it, but that queerness is deemed unsavory for teaching (especially at the grade, middle, and high school levels) because of hypocrisy. But I'm detouring, asfaik, CA was created by Joe Simon and Jack Kirby. Both of their families were Jewish immigrants (Simon's was from the UK, Kirby's was from Austria). I know that Kirby's family was rather poor and that he served in the army.

So, one could extrapolate that both of they added a lot of their own lives into creating CA.


yeah, & I found it kind of unbelievable that Bruce actually went along with it. it was one of those moments where the plausibility of that moment dropped to almost nothing and threatened to throw me out of the story entirely -- not Tony, more Bruce, who I was really surprised didn't put up more of a fight.

Indeed. I can see why Bruce helped the first time, but I can't find the reasoning behind him yielding to Tony a second time. One could argue that he was interested in the science angle, but that wouldn't hold up in court, really. I'm thinking he helped Tony because he's trying to run away from being the Hulk and feeling like he's got nothing to contribute other than being a vessel for "the other guy". However, that kinda puts him at odds with the way he behave in Avengers 1. Apparently, he won't be in Civil War, but will show up in the third Thor movie (that's set to premier next fall).

Have you watched the Thor movies, by the way? I have to say that they (especially the first one) were my gateway into MCU.


[...]would they have allowed anyone other than JW to get away with that?

I'm gonna go with yes. JW is someone who is well-liked in Hollywood, has worked in several things (as a producer, a film and TV director, a comic book writer, and a script doctor, for example), and has a lot of clout with the nerd crowd. That, coupled with the fact that the first Avengers movie made a lot of money, meant that he most definitely had more leeway that another director would.


but comic books are such long, serialized narratives. I can see why that would have huge advantages, but also present a number of problems and challenges in terms of character consistency and narrative continuity across numbers of films.

Well, comic books themselves have terrible continuity. After a while, titles get rebooted and/or retconned because TPTB themselves can't keep track of which superhero killed/married/fell in love with/turned out to be which supervillain. I mean, just to give you an idea, there have been about 18 - 20 different versions of Captain America (and not all of them are Steve Rogers) in the 50 or so years of Captain America's publishing history!

The problem with the MCU is the dissonance between the Russos' CA and JW's CA portrayals. We also see that with Bruce Banner in Avengers 1 vs. Bruce Banner in Avengers 2 (even though it's the same director and the same actor). From what I know, the Russos (in addition of doing Civil War) will be the directors behind Avengers: Infinity War part 1 and 2. So here's hoping there will be a more steady character flow for Cap and his crew.


even in an opposites attract kind of way, for there to be slashiness that I sense, there has to have been some kind of little moment or tete-a-tete where a little sliver of chemistry or attraction or humor slips out. and I just haven't seen that between Tony and Steve in the MCU movies. shrug

I think that if someone's a Steve/Tony fan from the comics, that person will be super disappointed by the movies (though, for obvious reasons, the same would not happen if a movie!fan goes and checks out the comics). In some ways, I do think there are a few bits in Avengers 1 that could potentially be seen as Steve/Tony slash (mostly the two of them getting in each other's face during the group argument and the last scene when Tony comes back to life and asks if anyone's kissed him. The camera pans to Steve who looks away with what could be argued is a wistful expression).

Though, in all truth, people will ship whatever even if there's no precedent. Tons of people ship Clint/Coulson (it became one of the "the" main ships in the MCU, like Top 5) after the first Thor movie in which those two characters had a brief scene that lasted less than one minute.

Another example is Sam/Bucky (which I ship). Logically-speaking, I don't know why I like that pairing that much, only that I find them irresistible together. And they interacted by fighting each other in a handful of scenes in CA:TWS.

In short, sometimes people will ship the obvious and sometimes they won't. ;P