verushka70

I mean, Steve and Sam flirted like WHOA at the beginning of the movie (after a meet cute even!)
True, very true. Rewatching CA:TFA I got the whole Steve/Bucky vibe, but TWS really brings the Steve/Sam imo. I also totally see the rom-com angle of Bucky=old flame/Sam=new flame, though obvs these are not rom-coms.

It is interesting, though, that they keep Steve from getting it on with any women, really. While I superfically buy the whole Agent-Carter torch-bearing and "haven't dated a woman in DECADES" stories, in reality his whole thing is far more likely to result from the fact that all his formative years he was a sickly, skinny, scrawny guy, and then when he was old enough and had something to prove, he couldn't get into the US Army no matter how many times he cheated and tried. All that's got to have left some emotional scars, making it difficult for him to make a move on anyone, male or female.

Indeed. TBH, I really liked how reflective and timely TWS was in regards to what's going on in the real world.

Yep.

My read on Steve is that he's definitely not the squeaky clean, "good boy" that some people might see him as. He'll do whatever he has to do to complete the mission, but he hasn't lost sight of the fact that governments are meant to be held accountable.

He's basically a moral person who questions things. He's also, unlike Tony (for example), not narcissistic or borderline megalomaniac... so he doesn't have the chutzpah (or arrogance) to think he can just do what he wants (or that anyone should) because the end always justifies the means; he knows that's not true. I think that's probably because he was that sickly, scrawny boy/guy for his whole life before becoming CA.

I was slightly disappointed with AoU. Despite the fact that there was a lot I liked (the in media res beginning, James Spader's Ultron), I was also annoyed and frustrated by Whedon stepping all over the canon and basically undoing a lot of the awesomeness from TWS.

I was going to ask what you meant by this last sentence, but then you explain it. :-) AoU was very whiz-bang "ACTION MOVIE!"-ish which TWS sort of wasn't, even though it was. In a way TWS was more than the sum of its parts, where as AoU was less. I felt, anyway.

Basically, he's gone on record about how his fave character is Tony Stark (with Steve being his least fave).

Oh god, really? *loses respect for JW on this alone* Well, that explains why Tony Stark has become more and more annoying over the course of the movies -- and I like RDJr, I've always liked him, ever since Less Than Zero a million years ago (so pretty, so broken, so gay-for-drugs, lol).

Egad, that means... Tony Stark is a Mary Sue! ICK!! Wow, this explains so much...!

This bias becomes pretty obvious when you look at the characterization of Steve in TWS (possibly depressed and suffering from a mild case of PTSD, having a complex personality who has no problems with breaking through the "perfect soldier" image that's been sold to the masses) vs. the characterizations for The Avengers and AoU (he's a prude who won't cuss, he's totally clueless/out of step with all aspects of modern life).

Yeah, I noticed all that and I was like, wha...? Oh, because Tony's around, CA is suddenly the anti-Tony? But if Tony is Joss, then Tony has to be the coolest and no one else is allowed to be as cool as Tony. Egad, this is awful.

One of the worst things that AoU did (and the one thing that I can't forgive Whedon for) is that at the end of TWS, Steve and Sam decide to go on a mission to find Bucky. In AoU, Steve and Sam talk about Sam's failed searches. It would've really helped to see them talk about Bucky and the search a little bit more because the way Steve talked about was way too casual (especially after watching TWS).

Yeah, that was puzzlingly superficial... but now it makes sense why. (But *why*, JW, wtf is wrong with you that you Mary Sue-ed yourself to Tony Stark, WHY?? You used to be so cool...)

I also hated (HATED) the way Natasha came off in AoU vs. TWS.

Yeah, I was like, Wait, what?? What happened to Natasha between then and now?

Even though Tony's going to be in Civil War (since that's part of main plot), I can't help but look forward to that movie. It's got the same cast and was shot by the same people that did TWS.

Well, that's good. Hopefully Tony won't steal the show as he always seems to want to (and be written to do). I also found it curious that Pepper was absent from AoU. I wasn't sure if that was due to a scheduling conflict for Paltrow or if she asked for more $$ than they were willing to pay her. It was a weird continuity blip, and having Tony address it as a matter of "billions-of-dollars corporations to run, girl's gone global" was unconvincing (though perhaps nothing would have been particularly convincing). I don't really care -- I guess she's not essential -- but it was one of those "throw you out of the story" moments.

I like how much canon there is. IIRC, Steve/Tony is THE ship based on the comics

Wow, really? I don't even see that. I could see Bruce/Tony more than Steve/Tony, but that's based only on the movies.

(I think there's even one issue that has an always a girl!Steve who marries Tony).

Wow. When were those comics written? Recently, or long ago, or in between? That seems remarkably progressive.

The only thing is that comics!Steve is less snarky and more of a hardass. Meanwhile, Tony's a bit sweeter and not so obnoxious as movie!Tony.

Hmmm. Interesting. Not interesting enough for me to read the comics, lol, but interesting, especially in light of how they've changed when they were written for movies.

But, yeah, there's a lot of canon to wade through (which is why I'm not really into reading their comic book versions).

I can understand that.

Sorry for the late reply to this. Still struggling w/tendinitis. And now SAD too I guess or the usual fibro malaise. Sigh.